Damn. Some Hollywood-level war porn vid in that report.
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Fullauto223cal (Old Spike)
Israel is taking care of business.
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danmanjones (Old Spike)
Making war on the American dime, with money you borrowed from China. "business"
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Fullauto223cal (Old Spike)
No actually, taking out the infrastructure of the Hamas fucks who exist for no other reason than to attack and kill Jews in Israel business.
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Thorno (Old Spike)
4/5 things you post are anti-Semitic pro Islam hit pieces or twisted to be. This is no different, they(Hamas and Islamic Jihad) fired first at civilians from Gaza with over 300 rockets in Mass barrages at CIVILIAN areas in an attampt to overpower Israel's anti missile defense systems - then Israel responded by hitting MILITARY targets. This while making many attempts at breaching Israel's border with some successful attempts, this wasn't with the intent of having lunch with Israelis it was to carry out attacks against Israelis , their agriculture or whatever they could damage before being caught.
If you had your way we'd all be Muslim and under Sharia law, any infidel would be killed, imprisoned or paying a jizra. That's no happening no matter how many times per you pray to your pedophilic , illetrate goat herder warlord or call everyone that says these things islamaphobic.
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danmanjones (Old Spike)
Israel attacked first in a botched special operation on Sunday, trying to kidnap a top Hamas military commander but failed & 7 Palestinians were killed. This is while peace negotiations were nearing completion & it was completely unprovoked. [source]
Hamas & Islamic Jihad's response & the Israeli reponse to the response came on Monday.
You say Israel only targetted military targets - they levelled several multi-story buildings including the TV station, part of a university & loads of homes & businesses.
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sato (Old Spike)
i think he's just as much against muslim terrorists as he is against israeli ones, and even if he wasn't, so what? that doesn't change what israel is doing. the have the entirety of palestine under lockdown, killing people daily by refusing them access to hospitals, water, their homes, and school. they won't allow construction material into palestine, or offer non-jewish isrealis the same legal protections they give jewish israelis.
it's pretty easy to say hamas attacked civilians, but if israel had your entire country under lockdown so you couldn't get anything at all or even farm your own land - remember there's no hamas in the west bank yet israel is doing the same thing there, so it's not anti-terror activities - and all you could do was fire rockets in the general direction of your oppressors, would you not do it?
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Dude (Old Spike)
Lol you realy think they hit military targets? and that only 3 ppl died? i sure hope so but i doubt it, if they had the balls they would have gaza under their foot and totaly locked down, but they don't from what i have seen jews have no spine, they are fearfull creatures, you can pump 400 billion in their army without any change all they do is hide behind their nukes, and pray to walls.
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Fullauto223cal (Old Spike)
"4/5 things you post are anti-Semitic pro Islam hit pieces or twisted to be."
This is SpikedNation, the fact that many members here are Jew hating Hamas supporters is nothing new. You just roll with it.
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Thorno (Old Spike)
The Islamic Jihad Movement in Palestine (Arabic: حركة الجهاد الإسلامي في فلسطين, Harakat al-Jihād al-Islāmi fi Filastīn) known in the West as simply Palestinian Islamic Jihad (PIJ), is a PalestinianIslamistterrorist organization formed in 1981 whose objective is the destruction of the State of Israel and the establishment of a sovereign, Islamic Palestinian state.
You are defending terrorist organizations, not surprising, Israel gave gaza to the palestintians and they fucked it up on turbo by electing Hamas for a start and then it went to shit in a hurry.
Below is one of my issues with anything relating to Islam (me being an 'infidel' with any level of basic logic, I have very few reasons to support it):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Jdv8kdhy4I
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danmanjones (Old Spike)
Brigitte Gabriel is an anti-Muslim activist who's stated that Muslims cannot be loyal citizens of the United States. Her video isn't relevant to the discussion, the topic is in the title & description of the post.
Gaza was never Israel's to give.
Claiming that I'm defending Islam &/or Hamas is an obvious strawman.
I think you should do more research bud. Try to look outside anti-Muslim sources & beyond Wikipedia if you want to understand the situation in Israel/Palestine. Framing it as a Muslim issue belies the fact that Palestine was 20% Christian & relatively peaceful ~100 years ago. How did it become a hotbed of violence?
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Thorno (Old Spike)
I am not going to spend serious amounts of time I should be spending elsewhere (work) upholding my statements with proper sourcing, I will leave that to you - you seem to have more free time on your hands. The whole middle east will always be at war with or without Israel, Islam is very far from anything peaceful by any group that actually abides by its tenents and the quran.
Danmajones, for some one so anti israel and so pro islam I have to asky what country do you live in and what part of the middle east are you or your roots from?
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danmanjones (Old Spike)
I'm not asking you to source anything you've said on this post. It's all ridiculous. I'm saying you need to take about 10 steps backwards & put some time into finding out what's happening over there, otherwise you come across as another ignorant "Muslims are evil" guy.
I'm not telling you where I live when you're still claiming I'm pro-Islam.
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Thorno (Old Spike)
If a country invades and wins irregardless of the past then thats it, the territory belongs to that winning country unless they give it back or lose a war that reclaims that land. Look at the US and indians for example or any of the other endless examples around the world. Israel won the land, regardless of the past, unless someone beats israel they will continue owning that land, Gaza falls under Israeli jurisdiction and they chose to give it back to the palestinians.
Find your own sources if you feel so inclined for an internet debate.
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danmanjones (Old Spike)
Acquiring land by conquest has been outlawed for nearly 100 years, since the formation of the League of Nations, & then by the United Nations.
It's a fundamental principle that prevents things like world wars.
It's not just a guideline, it's part of the treaty that each country signs in order to become a member the United Nations & recognized as a legitemate state. Annexing land is only allowed if the governing body of the region accepts the annexation.
There are rules to war and one of them is that you're allowed to invade a neighbouring territory if you're attacked, for as long as it takes to defend your territory. Since Israel aims to expand its territory it does everything it can to keep the conflict going. This is why I stated "Peace is the enemy of Zionism". It's not a silly accusation, it's based in reality.
For the conflict over there to cool down, Israel needs to declare its borders and abide by the fundemantal principles it signed onto when it became a member of the U.N.
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Fullauto223cal (Old Spike)
Acquiring land by conquest has been outlawed for nearly 100 years
Yea, that sounds nice, but it's all bullshit. Jordan surrendered it's claim to the West Bank and Gaza could be it's own little country but as we see, the Jew haters use the pretense of having their own country when in reality they simple see to destory Israel in the name of Islam.
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danmanjones (Old Spike)
The illegality of land by conquest has been outlawed since 1928. Your country wrote the treaty & was an original signatory.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kellogg–Briand_Pact
You can withdraw militarily from an area but surrendering the sovereignty of land isn't a thing.
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Fullauto223cal (Old Spike)
Did Israel sign the treaty? Yea, that's what I thought.
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danmanjones (Old Spike)
Did Israel exist in 1928?
The principles of the treaty were incorporated into the UN Charter which Israel formally declared its intention to honour in 1948
...the State of Israel hereby unreservedly accepts the obligations of the United Nations Charter and undertakes to honour them from the day when it becomes a Member of the United Nations."
Israel was accepted as a member of the UN in 1949 [source]
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Fullauto223cal (Old Spike)
So no, Israel didn't sign the treaty. That's all you had to write. Looking at your wikipedia article I'm not surpurised to see the following. "Many historians and political scientists see the pact as mostly irrelevant and ineffective." Exactly.
Now then, exactly who is it that Israel took land from? It sure wasn't this paper State of Palestine as it didn't "exist" until 1988. Israel was birthed out land that Britian controled following WW1 and was set aside to be a Jewish State. There was no "conquest", rather Israel declared it's independence and was immediatatly attacked. It fought off a second attempt at a genocide and won. The West Bank was occupied by Jordan and Gaza by Egypt. In 1967 the Arab nations attempted to destroy Israel a second time and again they lost and lost Gaza and the West Bank in the process. Those areas were not won by conquest, rather they were always intended to be a part of Israel and always have been.
In 2005 Israel removed itself from the Gaza strip and gave the paper State of Palestine a chance to prove it could exist as a peaceful neighbor. Sadly the people of Gaza have decided to wage an endless suicidal campaign against Israel.
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Thorno (Old Spike)
danmanjones, funny how you are willing to talk so much yet aren't willing to seven say what country you are in.
I have lived in many different countries and currently live 'over there' aka Israel and used to live about 30-40km away from Gaza in a city called Ashdod. We would get bombed very heavily whenever there were flair ups with Gaza - you talk about rules of war, how about bombing civilians? I don't see the hamas folks over there abiding by that?
Israel has killed civillians but not intentionally as opposed to hamas , as per their charter to destroy the state of israel, targets civilians intentionally.
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danmanjones (Old Spike)
It doesn't matter where I live but since you keep asking I'll tell you I live in NZ.
Both sides use indiscriminate methods. It's disgraceful.
Your claim that Israel doesn't target civilians is fakenews. In the past 6 months the IDF has been sniping Palestinian protestors (civilians) inside Gaza every Friday, killing over 200 & wounding about 20,000. Not a single Israeli was killed or seriously wounded during the protests.
In 2014 Israel levelled most of Gaza, targetting every manor of civilian infrastructure including schools & hospitals. The death toll was in the region of 600 fighters & 2,000 civilians. 20,000 homes were bombed. This is while using the latest in missile guidance technology with massive destructive power.
The only guided missile Hamas has used was on Monday when they fired a Kornet AT missile at a bus carrying IDF personnel & they waited until they'd gotten off the bus before firing.... here's the video:
It's true Hamas has not updated their charter to remove the parts about creating a Palestinian state in place of Israel. They offered to recognize Israel along the 1967 borders on multiple occasions & soften up their charter. Israel rejected it outright.
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Fullauto223cal (Old Spike)
The key there is "1967 borders". Either you don't know what that means or you're to dishonest to spell it out. The "1967 borders" is just another way of saying they want Israel to undo their victory in 1967. That shit will never happen, nor should it. The Palestinians have their land in Gaza, if they would stop being sadistic Jew hating animals maybe they could accomplish something, but I doubt it. All they know how to do is throw rocks and get shot. I have no sympathy for them.
Comments
(Long Spike)
Damn. Some Hollywood-level war porn vid in that report.
(Old Spike)
Israel is taking care of business.
(Old Spike)
Making war on the American dime, with money you borrowed from China. "business"
(Old Spike)
No actually, taking out the infrastructure of the Hamas fucks who exist for no other reason than to attack and kill Jews in Israel business.
(Old Spike)
4/5 things you post are anti-Semitic pro Islam hit pieces or twisted to be. This is no different, they(Hamas and Islamic Jihad) fired first at civilians from Gaza with over 300 rockets in Mass barrages at CIVILIAN areas in an attampt to overpower Israel's anti missile defense systems - then Israel responded by hitting MILITARY targets. This while making many attempts at breaching Israel's border with some successful attempts, this wasn't with the intent of having lunch with Israelis it was to carry out attacks against Israelis , their agriculture or whatever they could damage before being caught.
If you had your way we'd all be Muslim and under Sharia law, any infidel would be killed, imprisoned or paying a jizra. That's no happening no matter how many times per you pray to your pedophilic , illetrate goat herder warlord or call everyone that says these things islamaphobic.
(Old Spike)
Israel attacked first in a botched special operation on Sunday, trying to kidnap a top Hamas military commander but failed & 7 Palestinians were killed. This is while peace negotiations were nearing completion & it was completely unprovoked. [source]
Hamas & Islamic Jihad's response & the Israeli reponse to the response came on Monday.
You say Israel only targetted military targets - they levelled several multi-story buildings including the TV station, part of a university & loads of homes & businesses.
(Old Spike)
i think he's just as much against muslim terrorists as he is against israeli ones, and even if he wasn't, so what? that doesn't change what israel is doing. the have the entirety of palestine under lockdown, killing people daily by refusing them access to hospitals, water, their homes, and school. they won't allow construction material into palestine, or offer non-jewish isrealis the same legal protections they give jewish israelis.
it's pretty easy to say hamas attacked civilians, but if israel had your entire country under lockdown so you couldn't get anything at all or even farm your own land - remember there's no hamas in the west bank yet israel is doing the same thing there, so it's not anti-terror activities - and all you could do was fire rockets in the general direction of your oppressors, would you not do it?
(Old Spike)
Lol you realy think they hit military targets? and that only 3 ppl died? i sure hope so but i doubt it, if they had the balls they would have gaza under their foot and totaly locked down, but they don't from what i have seen jews have no spine, they are fearfull creatures, you can pump 400 billion in their army without any change all they do is hide behind their nukes, and pray to walls.
(Old Spike)
"4/5 things you post are anti-Semitic pro Islam hit pieces or twisted to be."
This is SpikedNation, the fact that many members here are Jew hating Hamas supporters is nothing new. You just roll with it.
(Old Spike)
The Islamic Jihad Movement in Palestine (Arabic: حركة الجهاد الإسلامي في فلسطين, Harakat al-Jihād al-Islāmi fi Filastīn) known in the West as simply Palestinian Islamic Jihad (PIJ), is a Palestinian Islamist terrorist organization formed in 1981 whose objective is the destruction of the State of Israel and the establishment of a sovereign, Islamic Palestinian state.
Hamas (Arabic: حماس Ḥamās, an acronym of حركة المقاومة الاسلامية Ḥarakat al-Muqāwamah al-ʾIslāmiyyah Islamic Resistance Movement) is a Palestinian Sunni-Islamist fundamentalist organization.[9][10] It has a social service wing, Dawah, and a military wing, the Izz ad-Din al-Qassam Brigades. It has been the de facto governing authority of the Gaza Strip since its takeover of that area in 2007.[11][12] During this period it fought several wars with Israel.[13] It is regarded, either in whole or in part, as a terrorist organization by several countries and international organizations, most notably by Israel, the United States and the European Union.[14][15][16] Russia, China, and Turkey are among countries who do not regard it so.[17][18][19][20]
(Old Spike)
You are defending terrorist organizations, not surprising, Israel gave gaza to the palestintians and they fucked it up on turbo by electing Hamas for a start and then it went to shit in a hurry.
Below is one of my issues with anything relating to Islam (me being an 'infidel' with any level of basic logic, I have very few reasons to support it):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Jdv8kdhy4I
(Old Spike)
Brigitte Gabriel is an anti-Muslim activist who's stated that Muslims cannot be loyal citizens of the United States. Her video isn't relevant to the discussion, the topic is in the title & description of the post.
Gaza was never Israel's to give.
Claiming that I'm defending Islam &/or Hamas is an obvious strawman.
I think you should do more research bud. Try to look outside anti-Muslim sources & beyond Wikipedia if you want to understand the situation in Israel/Palestine. Framing it as a Muslim issue belies the fact that Palestine was 20% Christian & relatively peaceful ~100 years ago. How did it become a hotbed of violence?
(Old Spike)
I am not going to spend serious amounts of time I should be spending elsewhere (work) upholding my statements with proper sourcing, I will leave that to you - you seem to have more free time on your hands. The whole middle east will always be at war with or without Israel, Islam is very far from anything peaceful by any group that actually abides by its tenents and the quran.
Danmajones, for some one so anti israel and so pro islam I have to asky what country do you live in and what part of the middle east are you or your roots from?
(Old Spike)
I'm not asking you to source anything you've said on this post. It's all ridiculous. I'm saying you need to take about 10 steps backwards & put some time into finding out what's happening over there, otherwise you come across as another ignorant "Muslims are evil" guy.
I'm not telling you where I live when you're still claiming I'm pro-Islam.
(Old Spike)
If a country invades and wins irregardless of the past then thats it, the territory belongs to that winning country unless they give it back or lose a war that reclaims that land. Look at the US and indians for example or any of the other endless examples around the world. Israel won the land, regardless of the past, unless someone beats israel they will continue owning that land, Gaza falls under Israeli jurisdiction and they chose to give it back to the palestinians.
Find your own sources if you feel so inclined for an internet debate.
(Old Spike)
Acquiring land by conquest has been outlawed for nearly 100 years, since the formation of the League of Nations, & then by the United Nations.
It's a fundamental principle that prevents things like world wars.
It's not just a guideline, it's part of the treaty that each country signs in order to become a member the United Nations & recognized as a legitemate state. Annexing land is only allowed if the governing body of the region accepts the annexation.
There are rules to war and one of them is that you're allowed to invade a neighbouring territory if you're attacked, for as long as it takes to defend your territory. Since Israel aims to expand its territory it does everything it can to keep the conflict going. This is why I stated "Peace is the enemy of Zionism". It's not a silly accusation, it's based in reality.
For the conflict over there to cool down, Israel needs to declare its borders and abide by the fundemantal principles it signed onto when it became a member of the U.N.
(Old Spike)
Acquiring land by conquest has been outlawed for nearly 100 years
Yea, that sounds nice, but it's all bullshit. Jordan surrendered it's claim to the West Bank and Gaza could be it's own little country but as we see, the Jew haters use the pretense of having their own country when in reality they simple see to destory Israel in the name of Islam.
(Old Spike)
The illegality of land by conquest has been outlawed since 1928. Your country wrote the treaty & was an original signatory.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kellogg–Briand_Pact
You can withdraw militarily from an area but surrendering the sovereignty of land isn't a thing.
(Old Spike)
Did Israel sign the treaty? Yea, that's what I thought.
(Old Spike)
Did Israel exist in 1928?
The principles of the treaty were incorporated into the UN Charter which Israel formally declared its intention to honour in 1948
Israel was accepted as a member of the UN in 1949 [source]
(Old Spike)
So no, Israel didn't sign the treaty. That's all you had to write. Looking at your wikipedia article I'm not surpurised to see the following. "Many historians and political scientists see the pact as mostly irrelevant and ineffective." Exactly.
Now then, exactly who is it that Israel took land from? It sure wasn't this paper State of Palestine as it didn't "exist" until 1988. Israel was birthed out land that Britian controled following WW1 and was set aside to be a Jewish State. There was no "conquest", rather Israel declared it's independence and was immediatatly attacked. It fought off a second attempt at a genocide and won. The West Bank was occupied by Jordan and Gaza by Egypt. In 1967 the Arab nations attempted to destroy Israel a second time and again they lost and lost Gaza and the West Bank in the process. Those areas were not won by conquest, rather they were always intended to be a part of Israel and always have been.
In 2005 Israel removed itself from the Gaza strip and gave the paper State of Palestine a chance to prove it could exist as a peaceful neighbor. Sadly the people of Gaza have decided to wage an endless suicidal campaign against Israel.
(Old Spike)
danmanjones, funny how you are willing to talk so much yet aren't willing to seven say what country you are in.
I have lived in many different countries and currently live 'over there' aka Israel and used to live about 30-40km away from Gaza in a city called Ashdod. We would get bombed very heavily whenever there were flair ups with Gaza - you talk about rules of war, how about bombing civilians? I don't see the hamas folks over there abiding by that?
Israel has killed civillians but not intentionally as opposed to hamas , as per their charter to destroy the state of israel, targets civilians intentionally.
(Old Spike)
It doesn't matter where I live but since you keep asking I'll tell you I live in NZ.
Both sides use indiscriminate methods. It's disgraceful.
Your claim that Israel doesn't target civilians is fakenews. In the past 6 months the IDF has been sniping Palestinian protestors (civilians) inside Gaza every Friday, killing over 200 & wounding about 20,000. Not a single Israeli was killed or seriously wounded during the protests.
In 2014 Israel levelled most of Gaza, targetting every manor of civilian infrastructure including schools & hospitals. The death toll was in the region of 600 fighters & 2,000 civilians. 20,000 homes were bombed. This is while using the latest in missile guidance technology with massive destructive power.
The only guided missile Hamas has used was on Monday when they fired a Kornet AT missile at a bus carrying IDF personnel & they waited until they'd gotten off the bus before firing.... here's the video:
It's true Hamas has not updated their charter to remove the parts about creating a Palestinian state in place of Israel. They offered to recognize Israel along the 1967 borders on multiple occasions & soften up their charter. Israel rejected it outright.
(Old Spike)
The key there is "1967 borders". Either you don't know what that means or you're to dishonest to spell it out. The "1967 borders" is just another way of saying they want Israel to undo their victory in 1967. That shit will never happen, nor should it. The Palestinians have their land in Gaza, if they would stop being sadistic Jew hating animals maybe they could accomplish something, but I doubt it. All they know how to do is throw rocks and get shot. I have no sympathy for them.